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	<title>Comments on: Giles Fraser on bloggers</title>
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	<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/</link>
	<description>by Dave Walker</description>
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		<title>By: MadPriest</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83885</link>
		<dc:creator>MadPriest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Feb 2007 00:28:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83885</guid>
		<description>And a lot of journalists want to be theologians.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And a lot of journalists want to be theologians.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Brown</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83754</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Brown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Feb 2007 10:15:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83754</guid>
		<description>Giles wasn&#039;t the first, and won&#039;t be the last, to be horrified at the standard of Comment is Free. I think anyone who writes for the paper &quot;Guardian&quot; wants to believe that our readers are not the poisonous, stupid, hateful scum who seemed to run wild over the site last summmer. Some of the things written about Madeleine Bunting, eg, were really upsetting. Things are better now, but anyone who writes anything has a sense of someone listening to their voice, and that ideal someone is not often a CiF commenter - nor one on a lot of other blogs. 

Part of the problem is, I think, that a lot of the commentators want to be journalists, and can&#039;t see what is hard or worthwhile about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Giles wasn&#8217;t the first, and won&#8217;t be the last, to be horrified at the standard of Comment is Free. I think anyone who writes for the paper &#8220;Guardian&#8221; wants to believe that our readers are not the poisonous, stupid, hateful scum who seemed to run wild over the site last summmer. Some of the things written about Madeleine Bunting, eg, were really upsetting. Things are better now, but anyone who writes anything has a sense of someone listening to their voice, and that ideal someone is not often a CiF commenter &#8211; nor one on a lot of other blogs. </p>
<p>Part of the problem is, I think, that a lot of the commentators want to be journalists, and can&#8217;t see what is hard or worthwhile about it.</p>
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		<title>By: MadPriest</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83753</link>
		<dc:creator>MadPriest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Feb 2007 09:39:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83753</guid>
		<description>Dave
As far as I can see the only advertising you do is self-advertising - and you&#039;ve got a living to make.
Anyway, yours is a mutant blog - I file you under &quot;resource.&quot; Not that I don&#039;t enjoy your chat as well (well, as long as you&#039;re not getting at angry humourists, that is).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dave<br />
As far as I can see the only advertising you do is self-advertising &#8211; and you&#8217;ve got a living to make.<br />
Anyway, yours is a mutant blog &#8211; I file you under &#8220;resource.&#8221; Not that I don&#8217;t enjoy your chat as well (well, as long as you&#8217;re not getting at angry humourists, that is).</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83609</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Feb 2007 19:17:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83609</guid>
		<description>I too usually think Giles speaks a lot of sense.

Mad Priest: I&#039;d often wondered why people look at me as if I&#039;m a lower life form. I&#039;d thought it was the gills.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I too usually think Giles speaks a lot of sense.</p>
<p>Mad Priest: I&#8217;d often wondered why people look at me as if I&#8217;m a lower life form. I&#8217;d thought it was the gills.</p>
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		<title>By: Karin</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83577</link>
		<dc:creator>Karin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Feb 2007 15:19:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83577</guid>
		<description>I usually think Giles speaks a lot of sense.  Perhaps he&#039;s had some bad experiences of bloggers.  Like anything blogs can be used for good or ill and bloggers represent a cross-section of society.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I usually think Giles speaks a lot of sense.  Perhaps he&#8217;s had some bad experiences of bloggers.  Like anything blogs can be used for good or ill and bloggers represent a cross-section of society.</p>
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		<title>By: MadPriest</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83560</link>
		<dc:creator>MadPriest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Feb 2007 12:01:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83560</guid>
		<description>Giles Fraser makes money from most of what he says and writes. He also, at least in his parish, likes to be in control. He puts his photograph on much of what he publishes.

In the blogging world words, ideas and images are given away (those who allow advertising on their blogs are viewed as lower life forms). The net is anarchic and anonymity is easily obtained.

It is no surprise to me, that Giles, who refuses to engage with the blogging community although they often cite him, should be scared of this new world. His power and authority come from the established church and academia. The Christian blogging community is part of the emerging church (even the conservatives are part of this trend). Christian blogs are more akin to a service in the back room of a pub than a service in an impressive church in a posh part of London.

In other words Giles is not part of our world and we are not part of his. Thank goodness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Giles Fraser makes money from most of what he says and writes. He also, at least in his parish, likes to be in control. He puts his photograph on much of what he publishes.</p>
<p>In the blogging world words, ideas and images are given away (those who allow advertising on their blogs are viewed as lower life forms). The net is anarchic and anonymity is easily obtained.</p>
<p>It is no surprise to me, that Giles, who refuses to engage with the blogging community although they often cite him, should be scared of this new world. His power and authority come from the established church and academia. The Christian blogging community is part of the emerging church (even the conservatives are part of this trend). Christian blogs are more akin to a service in the back room of a pub than a service in an impressive church in a posh part of London.</p>
<p>In other words Giles is not part of our world and we are not part of his. Thank goodness.</p>
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		<title>By: ash</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83550</link>
		<dc:creator>ash</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Feb 2007 11:31:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83550</guid>
		<description>It is so often conventional media people who attack blogs, though. As if Mass Media and their journalists aren&#039;t the bigger problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is so often conventional media people who attack blogs, though. As if Mass Media and their journalists aren&#8217;t the bigger problem.</p>
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		<title>By: David Keen</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83525</link>
		<dc:creator>David Keen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Feb 2007 09:43:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83525</guid>
		<description>For intemperate bloggers substitute intemperate politicians, neighbours, tabloid columnists, Big Brother contestants, Church Times writers, etc. 

Culturally we have long lost the ability to have a sensible debate in public without name calling and aggression, what appears on blogs is just a symptom of this. 

The main problem is that the internet doesn&#039;t introduce space to think. Comments can be fired off without the tiresome business of writing a letter, finding an envelope, buying a stamp and then missing the post, all of which gives the chance to decide you didn&#039;t really want to send the letter anyway. I regularly hit the &#039;submit comment&#039; button by accident before I&#039;ve composed a comment that&#039;s fit for public debate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For intemperate bloggers substitute intemperate politicians, neighbours, tabloid columnists, Big Brother contestants, Church Times writers, etc. </p>
<p>Culturally we have long lost the ability to have a sensible debate in public without name calling and aggression, what appears on blogs is just a symptom of this. </p>
<p>The main problem is that the internet doesn&#8217;t introduce space to think. Comments can be fired off without the tiresome business of writing a letter, finding an envelope, buying a stamp and then missing the post, all of which gives the chance to decide you didn&#8217;t really want to send the letter anyway. I regularly hit the &#8216;submit comment&#8217; button by accident before I&#8217;ve composed a comment that&#8217;s fit for public debate.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83441</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Feb 2007 00:17:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83441</guid>
		<description>Unfortunately this seems to be another of the periodic examples of someone in the regular media having a go at bloggers with unfortunately not much knowledge.

Most importantly, as you point out, he&#039;s confusing people who comment with people who have their own blogs, and although bloggers will often comment on other blogs, there are also a lot of people who don&#039;t blog themselves, but merely comment.

To my mind, a blog can be like a variety of different media, depending on how the site is run. You can run it as a free-for-all, and let people post any comments they like. Robert Scoble is probably the most high profile blogger like that, and a number of other bloggers can&#039;t understand why he allows it.

Alternatively you can run it in a more restricted way. For example I have my comment policy posted on the page - essentially that we reserve the right to remove any comments that are offensive, illegal rude, or otherwise out of keeping with the site. Since Wordpress logs all the IP addresses for anyone who comments, I can also check out dodgy postings, and also anyone who is putting in a phoney e-mail address or website.

Perhaps the best example of this was when a couple of Beth&#039;s students discovered the site (any IP addresses in the school are now blocked by the way) and posted a fake comment under a classmates name. Unfortunately, as the site logs the IP address and the time, and the school logs everything the students do on the web, it was pretty easy to track down who it was who was really posting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Unfortunately this seems to be another of the periodic examples of someone in the regular media having a go at bloggers with unfortunately not much knowledge.</p>
<p>Most importantly, as you point out, he&#8217;s confusing people who comment with people who have their own blogs, and although bloggers will often comment on other blogs, there are also a lot of people who don&#8217;t blog themselves, but merely comment.</p>
<p>To my mind, a blog can be like a variety of different media, depending on how the site is run. You can run it as a free-for-all, and let people post any comments they like. Robert Scoble is probably the most high profile blogger like that, and a number of other bloggers can&#8217;t understand why he allows it.</p>
<p>Alternatively you can run it in a more restricted way. For example I have my comment policy posted on the page &#8211; essentially that we reserve the right to remove any comments that are offensive, illegal rude, or otherwise out of keeping with the site. Since WordPress logs all the IP addresses for anyone who comments, I can also check out dodgy postings, and also anyone who is putting in a phoney e-mail address or website.</p>
<p>Perhaps the best example of this was when a couple of Beth&#8217;s students discovered the site (any IP addresses in the school are now blocked by the way) and posted a fake comment under a classmates name. Unfortunately, as the site logs the IP address and the time, and the school logs everything the students do on the web, it was pretty easy to track down who it was who was really posting.</p>
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		<title>By: Tired&#38;Emotional</title>
		<link>http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/comment-page-1/#comment-83423</link>
		<dc:creator>Tired&#38;Emotional</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Feb 2007 22:54:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cartoonchurch.com/blog/2007/02/04/giles-fraser-on-bloggers/#comment-83423</guid>
		<description>Our local paper&#039;s comment section is a hive of &quot;Daily Mail&quot; style comments that seem to consist of insulting everyone/thing that they consider to be &quot;unBritish/Welsh&quot;. Some of the comments relating to gypsies had me fuming - and me a Conservative as well! I think that they should moderate their comments areas and not just let people write insulting and racist comments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Our local paper&#8217;s comment section is a hive of &#8220;Daily Mail&#8221; style comments that seem to consist of insulting everyone/thing that they consider to be &#8220;unBritish/Welsh&#8221;. Some of the comments relating to gypsies had me fuming &#8211; and me a Conservative as well! I think that they should moderate their comments areas and not just let people write insulting and racist comments.</p>
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